Her appointment in the spring of 2021 attracted a lot of interest. With Hielkema, the Netherlands had won an important European position. It even earned her a congratulation from then outgoing minister Wopke Hoekstra. She herself said that she wants to "challenge pension funds and insurers to play a role in the transition to a more resilient and sustainable economy". She called her appointment a "great, but also exciting step".
As Division Director supervision at DNB, Hielkema already knew the insurance sector well. But in the field of retirement, she said she had to "kick it up a notch".

The interview takes place in a meeting room at the Dutch Association of Insurers. Hielkema presented EIOPA's strategic priorities to the Association's Board. She turns out to be an easy and enthusiastic talker who is also averse to any authority. "When I visit a member state, I always want to talk to the people in the workplace at the national supervisory authority. I would like to know what they encounter in their work for EIOPA. People sometimes react to this with surprise. But it is very much appreciated."

Let's get straight to the point. You have been chairperson for over a year now. How do you like it in Frankfurt?

"Good. It's an incredibly fun role, but it also took some getting used to that first year. Especially in corona times. I was in Frankfurt, together with my Executive Director Fausto Parente. While most of the rest of my colleagues were somewhere in Europe. That lasted until March this year, mainly due to the strict rules in Germany. It had many disadvantages, but also one advantage. When I spoke somewhere, I didn't have to go out on the floor on my own. After my talk I answered some questions and I could continue. That is in stark contrast to how things are going now."

How do you mean?

"When I'm at a conference now, a lot of people  approach me. Which is very nice and usefull, but I had to get used to it. The number of times you are approached as a Dutch supervisor or as chairperson of EIOPA differs considerably. Nowadays I have to pull out all the stops to get to the coffee."

Is it a big transition from a national to a European supervisory authority?

"It's small and big at the same time. With the exception of four years, I have always done insurance supervision at DNB. Much of what we do now has to do with supervision, policy and Solvency II. Familiar territory, in other words. In this sense, the move from DNB to EIOPA has been a small one. New to me was the work on conduct supervision. I had to put extra work in there. But what I have experienced above all as a big step is that from a small Member State to Europe. When I say something now, I am speaking on behalf of Europe. That gives a completely different starting position, because every Member State is now looking at me. After all, I am talking to the Americans, the Japanese and the Swiss. As a Dutch person, I was not used to that role. A big step, but a lot of fun."

What do you like about it?

"I can now talk on a different level. As I am chair of the three ESAs (EBA, ESMA and EIOPA) this year, I am currently also the second vice-chair of the European Systemic Risk Board. The chairperson is Christine Lagarde and the vice chairman Stefan Ingves ("the Swedish Klaas Knot"). As a deputy , the chance that I really have to chair is very small, but the fact that I'm there, I really like. The themes we discuss are at the heart of financial and economic developments in the EU. In any case, I find the European discussion extremely interesting. I'm much closer to the subjects. And to better understand what is happening here and there, I regularly visit one of the Member States. I try to learn as much as possible from that country in two days. Who are here? What does their market look like? What are their concerns? Why are these concerns there? And what can we do as a European authority? As a European supervisory authority, you can have much more impact than as a supervisor in the Netherlands. That's very interesting."

Crème de la crème for someone who loves supervision?

"Absolutely. It's the next level. And that in a place where I can make a difference on a topic like diversity. Because I am now at board level, I can put my own accents. For example, we recently asked for the need for diversity in insurers and pension funds to be included in the law. Whether that will happen remains unsure, but I can indicate it as a theme that I find important."

That's what you did when you took office. One of your personal spearheads was to get more women to the top and to strive for a better balance in diversity.

"Yes, that often goes unnoticed. I regularly get messages from women on my LinkedIn, who call me an example. The fact that I am very open about combining my private life with a career helps with that. And, not unimportantly, I stay true to myself. Already during my time at DNB, I have taken the oppertunity to draw attention to diversity. For example, I rarely walk in a dark blue suit."

It's still close to your heart?

"Awareness is still needed. Women still have a bigger pension gap than men to name just one thing. I recently read a brilliant book (Invisible women) about data use. The writer comes up with example after example that the data itself is already biased . One of the examples is that someone wanted gender-neutral policies in a Swedish village. She also took a closer look at the snow shifting policy to see if that is gender bias . And what turned out? The first snowplows hit the road for the early workers. These are usually men, in a good car. With two centimeters of snow, they are not at such a risk, and because it was only possible to sweep on the cycling lanes and at bus stops later, many people who were on their way to school fell. When they reversed that snow sliding schedule, the number of accidents and with it the personal injury cases dropped significatly. Isn't that a good example that you would never come up with yourself? In daily life I try to pay attention to color, gender, but certainly also to cultural background in many things. I also consciously do that in my own team."

Do you do that because you're in this position and you feel more or less obligated to pay attention to diversity? Or is this inherent to you?

"I already wore a woman's sign around my neck when I was sixteen, so there's no doubt about that. In addition, I have a husband who is also working on diversity. If you do nothing, you are hopelessly behind as far as I'm concerned. Every person needs support. I remember as if it were yesterday when the reinsurers in our country came under supervision. Joanne Kellerman addressed them. I worked as a policy advisor at DNB and had prepared everything. The moment she started talking, I thought: I can stand there too. The stupid thing is that I never thought that with men. I once listened to a statement by Danièle Nouy (former head of banking supervision at the ECB, among others). She said at the end of a lecture: just one more thing, especially for the ladies. If you are ever asked to chair an international working group, you first say yes and then you start thinking. I've always remembered that."

Why is it that the balance is still not there?

"No idea. It is often said that it is hard to find good people, but I think that is nonsense. You have to want to find them. But even if you can't find them, you can still train them? I've long thought that hard work and doing your best should be enough, but the higher you get, the more men there are in the room. I have to say, that was not so bad at the Dutch Association's Boardmeeting I just attended. Perhaps because this is somthing the Dutch insurance sector has paid attention to? My husband always says, if you're at the CEO level, you have to be careful with photos or you end up in a newspaper or social media with only men in gray or blue suits."

What are other hot topics in Europe?

"Macroeconomic developments are currently the topic of discussion. The situation is very worrying given the impact of Russia's war against Ukraine, the energy crisis and the impact this has on the European market. We are in a rapidly changing world and have to deal with different interest rates. For insurers, a higher interest rate is not so bad, but the road ahead is bumpy. This does not happen in one smooth movement and therefore requires attention to the risks. In addition, sustainability is and remains a hot topic in Europe. The role of insurers in this area is very essential. I always call that insuring with impact. After all, insurers can help with incentives, so that we all become greener. What is very important to me and especially important in other European countries, is the value of an insurance product. If you're selling a product, it should also provide value. In Europe we call this value for money. How is a product developed, sold and then monitored? Are products developed for and sold to the right target group? Does it benefit the policyholders? Are the costs justified? We deal with these kinds of questions. And finally, we're going to supervise the cloud providers, including Amazon web, Google, and those kinds of companies. We now have a mandate, but we still have to put our money where our mouth is. A huge job."

Exciting?

"Absolutely. Especially because it is also new to us. I am pleased that I have already gained the necessary experience for operational supervision at DNB. As a result, I already know something about infrastructures and that comes in handy now. The companies that offer these services have always said that everything is in order. Now they have to show it and that will take some getting used to for them."

This will be a completely new form of supervision. Can you do that yourself or do you have to tap into a new group on the labor market to supervise?

"The latter, so it will be an extra big challenge. We have been allocated a total of thirty FTEs with the three ESAs, ten of which are for EIOPA, and will have to search in the ICT corner. But that's only when we get started. The design and writing work must come from the existing capacity. That will be a tough job, but of course we do it together with the ESAs and the national supervisory authorities. I love technology and new things, I also believe in the need for supervision. We will probably encounter some hurdles in the process, but these are professional companies. They are not suspicious and if everything is in order, as they say themselves, they only have to show it."

In the meantime, the laws and regulations for insurers are only increasing. Do you understand that they sometimes sigh under all that regulatory pressure?

"Yes, I get that. It's a lot. I think it applies to everyone, because no one can open a can of people when something new comes along. This also applies to us. I regularly have to look at my team and think: how? We started with prudential supervision. That's where the conduct came in and now sustainability, digitization, cyber and IT also take up a lot of work. The scope is getting bigger and bigger, while the teams are not growing at the same pace. And that too at a time when there is a war on talent going on. We all need IT knowledge. That doesn't make it easy. Certainly not for a sector that is not known as the sexiest part of the economy."

Insurers should advertise themselves a bit more?

"I think so. For example  at AI. The EU comes up with a regulation, with all kinds of nice terms and definitions, but what do insurers do? For years? And with what technology? It's actually super hip what they do, but insurers don't call it AI. They're talking about a mathematical model. Insurers could also say: 'Well, we have been working with Artificial Intelligence for years. We have a lot of experience with that'. They don't say that, because that's not in their nature to boast about this. But does that make it less sexy? No, of course not. And here, too, diversity helps. The first thing that many in Europe think of when it comes to insurers is men in suits. That connotation is very important for your image. That is not something you can change that is something you have to change."

Finally, what can EIOPA do to alleviate that regulatory burden?

"A few things. Among other things, we provide guidance. Some insurers indicate, for example in the application guidance on sustainability in the ORSA, that this is of little use to them. They are already much further ahead, but another part is helped by this. The second thing we do is to pay serious attention to the timelines for policy development. We must be given sufficient time for consultation. For example, we are now working on the Principles for Averse Impact within the Taxonomy Regulation and have requested more time from Brussels specifically for that regulation. I'm glad to say we now got that time. We think this is important, because decision-making is enriched when the market has the time to respond to that consultation. That dialogue is essential and leads to better policies!"

(Text: Miranda de Groene)